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Saturday, May 03, 2008
Age of Conan first impressions
I don't know why I still fall for it. A new game comes and promises to be new and different. A new combat system, a new world, a new way to play. And then I start the new game, wash up on yet another beach, see yet another quest giver with a golden exclamation mark over his head, and start slaying yet another endless number of beasts and monsters by pressing the same hotkeys over and over. After my first day in Age of Conan my biggest impression isn't of what is new, but how similar it is to all the other fantasy MMORPGs out there. At which point the question becomes why should I play AoC and not WoW?
Sure the graphics are more photorealistic pretty in Age of Conan. But not only do I like the cartoony graphics of WoW, they also work well on any computer. Age of Conan, even at times of low server load and in single-player instances, isn't running smoothly. I have a better than the recommended specs, and most of the time the game plays with a good framerate. And then sometimes the graphics just freeze up for a second or two. Now somebody is going to come with the age old "but this is just a beta / stress test" excuse. Well, I got enough experience with these games to tell what kind of flaws are normal for a stress test, and what kind of defects will still be there in three weeks when the game is released. And the jerkiness is going to stay with us, and it is extremely annoying.
Apart from that, Age of Conan is less buggy than I would have thought. Most things you do work as intended. Pre-WoW I would have called it "up to industry standards", but that is because industry standards were so low back then, and WoW pushed them up. AoC is not up to WoW technical excellence standards. I did get stuck more than once on my first day, I did fall through the floor, I saw graphical glitches like seeing a mob's grid of polygons instead of the texture. Nothing game stopping. If you come with a certain determination to play this game, you'll be able to overlook the bugs. If you only played WoW up to now and are under the mistaken impression that all MMORPGs are bug-free like WoW, you'll be in for a bad surprise.
The combat system of Age of Conan is "new", but not radically so. In fact, if you play a caster class, you won't even notice the difference. All your spells and special attacks are done in the same way as in EQ, EQ2, WoW, LotRO, etc., by targeting an enemy and pressing a hotkey. What is new is that there is no autoattack any more, a change which basically affects only melee classes. Instead of autotattack you get three buttons for striking left, right, or middle. You can get a video explanation of the system here. Enemies have three "shields" around them, which could be all protecting the same direction, or distributed over the three directions. Now if you repeatedly hit a mob with the left button for example, it is going to move its defences to the left. Which automatically exposes some other direction, which is now unprotected. If you are a rocket scientist, you just might come up with the idea to hit the mob on the unprotected side now. That is called an "active combat system". Melee characters hotkeys also have moves that don't happen instantly, but require you to press a combo of buttons, like left-left-right. You hit the hotkey for the special move, get a window showing you what to do, and when you do that combination, you'll do an extra move as well for more damage or other effects. Don't get me wrong, this *is* an improvement over auto-attack. It just isn't a huge improvement. I was needlessly afraid it would be twitchy, but it isn't. Worst you could say is that now every melee character has to press as many buttons as a rogue in WoW.
Gameplay is very similar to every other fantasy MMORPG out there. You get quests to kill someone, or to collect something, or to go somewhere and talk to someone. One improvement is that usually you just have to kill one guy for a quest, and all the other kills you do just happen to stand in the way. I haven't had a single "kill 10 foozles" quest yet. But as everywhere else, kills and quests give you xp, which make you rise up in levels, which gives you new spells and abilities. My first new spells and abilities just fell from the sky when I reached the new levels, but then I was sent to a "trainer". I expected him to sell me new spells, but instead he is sending me on various quests, the quest rewards of which are the new spells. Nice system! I just would have wished that the so-called destiny quests had a bit more to do with class abilities and acted as sort of an endless tutorial for your existing abilities. But in fact there is no tutorial at all, except for the tutorial videos on Fileplanet. Not that this isn't much of a hurdle for anyone who already played another MMORPG.
You start the game in what turns out to be an instance, and the destiny quests are also instanced. You can switch between "day" multi-player and "night" instance single-player mode by talking to certain NPCs. So if for example your destiny quest is too hard for you and you need another level to succeed, you switch into day mode and do other quests or farm mobs in the multi-player part of the world. The two modes use mirror images of the same world, but you can only do the day quests in day mode and the night quests in night mode. Still, it is an interesting system. And especially in a stress test it gives you the possibility to stick mostly to the solo part, and avoid the lag and kill-stealing which is inevitable in crowded multiplayer areas.
Age of Conan is not a bad game, and it brings some innovation to the genre. But unless you are bored of World of Warcraft, I can't think of any compelling reason to play AoC instead of WoW. You would really need to absolutely love some of the new features to make you willing to overlook the bugs and shortcomings of AoC. As a "I want to take a break from WoW until WotLK comes out" game, Age of Conan is good enough, although Lord of the Rings Online might be the better alternative if you don't know that one yet. I'll buy AoC and play around with it a bit more until WAR and WotLK come out, but I don't see it as more as a stop gap solution. Not bad, but not enough to topple World of Warcraft from it's throne.
- posted by Tobold @ 6:56 AM Permanent Link
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"WoW technical excellence standards"
After release I seem to remember bouts of bad lag, instance crashing, server crashing, npc spawn crashing and, in rare instances, database wipes. Maybe you just happened to be on one of those "good" servers.
After release I seem to remember bouts of bad lag, instance crashing, server crashing, npc spawn crashing and, in rare instances, database wipes. Maybe you just happened to be on one of those "good" servers.
# posted by 
: 3/5/08 09:30
: 3/5/08 09:30
I don't think it matters much how good WoW was at release. It's not fair, but Age of Conan will have to deal with a WoW after 3 years of improvement, not a WoW after release. The average player won't be interested in comparing WoW at release with AoC at release, he will simply want to know which one is the better game of the two right now.
# posted by : 3/5/08 11:42
: 3/5/08 11:42
How about...ugh.
This game is scheduled for release in a couple of weeks. At most, this is a stress test.
I can't imagine that many bugs are going to get worked out before release. CD/DvDs should be printed and slated for shipment at this point.
Just another example of "we'll fix it later, buy it now".
Pezzy, while I understand the concept of a beta test, why would anyone choose to play a game that is obviously bugged, compared to WoW?
Why should games be released before they are finished?
To me, it seems that in the rush to get it out and earning money, many people will get a taste of it, and run away in terror, back to the comforts of WoW...that runs beautifully on even an old system.
Not only is this not a WoW killer, it will be lucky to get as many people as LoTR, or any other "niche" mmo.
Say what you want, but there is a new standard.
And it's WoW. For what it's worth, people can install it now, get a pretty comprehensive mmo that runs almost flawlessly.
Games don't exist in a vaccuum. The comparison, obviously, exists.
If you can't make your game run as smooth as WoW, regardless of what WoW ran like when it first came out over 3 YEARS AGO, its going to be it's own worst enemy.
Or, in the words of LaVar Burton, "you don't have to take my word for it".
This game may be its own worst enemy. Or maybe I'm just a hater.
Go play it.
This game is scheduled for release in a couple of weeks. At most, this is a stress test.
I can't imagine that many bugs are going to get worked out before release. CD/DvDs should be printed and slated for shipment at this point.
Just another example of "we'll fix it later, buy it now".
Pezzy, while I understand the concept of a beta test, why would anyone choose to play a game that is obviously bugged, compared to WoW?
Why should games be released before they are finished?
To me, it seems that in the rush to get it out and earning money, many people will get a taste of it, and run away in terror, back to the comforts of WoW...that runs beautifully on even an old system.
Not only is this not a WoW killer, it will be lucky to get as many people as LoTR, or any other "niche" mmo.
Say what you want, but there is a new standard.
And it's WoW. For what it's worth, people can install it now, get a pretty comprehensive mmo that runs almost flawlessly.
Games don't exist in a vaccuum. The comparison, obviously, exists.
If you can't make your game run as smooth as WoW, regardless of what WoW ran like when it first came out over 3 YEARS AGO, its going to be it's own worst enemy.
Or, in the words of LaVar Burton, "you don't have to take my word for it".
This game may be its own worst enemy. Or maybe I'm just a hater.
Go play it.
"WoW technical excellence standards"
After release I seem to remember bouts of bad lag, instance crashing, server crashing, npc spawn crashing and, in rare instances, database wipes. Maybe you just happened to be on one of those "good" servers.
Perhaps the worst problem was loot lag. You know, where you tried to loot a mob and got stuck in the looting position. You could move around but not activate any abilities. Annoying as hell.
I remember trying the open beta back then and shouting over general that Blizzard better fix it for release. Guess what answer I got? That's right, "It's only beta ffs!!". Well I said it back then that it would still be there for release, something like that wouldn't be easily fixed. And sure enough, it was still there at release. They made it much better after a few months but it's still there and you can from time to time still experience it.
After release I seem to remember bouts of bad lag, instance crashing, server crashing, npc spawn crashing and, in rare instances, database wipes. Maybe you just happened to be on one of those "good" servers.
Perhaps the worst problem was loot lag. You know, where you tried to loot a mob and got stuck in the looting position. You could move around but not activate any abilities. Annoying as hell.
I remember trying the open beta back then and shouting over general that Blizzard better fix it for release. Guess what answer I got? That's right, "It's only beta ffs!!". Well I said it back then that it would still be there for release, something like that wouldn't be easily fixed. And sure enough, it was still there at release. They made it much better after a few months but it's still there and you can from time to time still experience it.
Seems the Open Beta is way older and buggier than the Closed Beta, so the blunder seems to in PR, not in coding. This time.
See: http://www.keenandgraev.com/?p=1018
See: http://www.keenandgraev.com/?p=1018
@Magrothj: That loot bug is still in the game - from time to time (not assoften as in the "early days" though) I still get stuck in looting position and have to relog in order to fix it.
AoC i beta so obviouly it can't really have the same polish as WoW - and WoW also still has plenty of bugs left, like all BG exploits and falling through the world isn't completely unheard either.
Having said that, I'm having hard time believing AoC would be the WoW-killer everyone is talking about.
Currently Blizzards biggest enemy is Blizzard themselves as it seems they're really struggling getting new content/features out in time.
...and perhaps WAR ;-)
AoC i beta so obviouly it can't really have the same polish as WoW - and WoW also still has plenty of bugs left, like all BG exploits and falling through the world isn't completely unheard either.
Having said that, I'm having hard time believing AoC would be the WoW-killer everyone is talking about.
Currently Blizzards biggest enemy is Blizzard themselves as it seems they're really struggling getting new content/features out in time.
...and perhaps WAR ;-)
# posted by : 3/5/08 14:21
: 3/5/08 14:21
I wonder how much of the "meh" view is from being used to the high end in WoW with all the abilities, tactics, raiding, PvP, and other, etc. worked out, as. being at the start of Age of Conan with beginning quests, which will naturally be more limited.
It's not all that surprising to me that Age of conan has all those usual similarities to other MMORPgs, which is how things seem to work in other entertainment areas. ("This action movie is just more gun fights, martial arts, sneering at each other", for a sort of example.)
It's not all that surprising to me that Age of conan has all those usual similarities to other MMORPgs, which is how things seem to work in other entertainment areas. ("This action movie is just more gun fights, martial arts, sneering at each other", for a sort of example.)
http://bildos.blogspot.com/2008/05/aoc-closed-beta-worlds-different-than.html
Sadly, this was a boner of a move. Hope they rectify it soon.
Sadly, this was a boner of a move. Hope they rectify it soon.
"At which point the question becomes why should I play AoC and not WoW?"
For novelty's sake. Personally, I can't stomach to play WoW anymore. Yes, it's a very good, very accessible, very polished game that I once loved... but I've burned out playing it for so long. I'm tired of its gameplay, its world, and its community.
WoW is overplayed, overdiscussed, and overdocumented. It feels more like an iteractive database than an adventure now. I'm done with it. Adding more levels, more dungeons, more whatever won't bring me back. I want something *different*.
It doesn't have to to be as polished as WoW. It doesn't even have to be as 'good', in terms of the coheseveness and smoothness of the experience. It just has to be different enough to qualify as an exciting new adventure, it has to be accessible, and it has to be fun and stay fun for a while.
I tried some other MMOs out there, and I liked a few of them, but none have managed to keep my attention for very long for one of the reasons above or other. I don't know if AoC will fit my requirements, but I'm willing to give it a try.
Why eat apples when oranges are perfectly good? Because they taste differently!
For novelty's sake. Personally, I can't stomach to play WoW anymore. Yes, it's a very good, very accessible, very polished game that I once loved... but I've burned out playing it for so long. I'm tired of its gameplay, its world, and its community.
WoW is overplayed, overdiscussed, and overdocumented. It feels more like an iteractive database than an adventure now. I'm done with it. Adding more levels, more dungeons, more whatever won't bring me back. I want something *different*.
It doesn't have to to be as polished as WoW. It doesn't even have to be as 'good', in terms of the coheseveness and smoothness of the experience. It just has to be different enough to qualify as an exciting new adventure, it has to be accessible, and it has to be fun and stay fun for a while.
I tried some other MMOs out there, and I liked a few of them, but none have managed to keep my attention for very long for one of the reasons above or other. I don't know if AoC will fit my requirements, but I'm willing to give it a try.
Why eat apples when oranges are perfectly good? Because they taste differently!
# posted by : 3/5/08 14:53
: 3/5/08 14:53
I don't think most people believe AoC will be a WoW killer. What they want is something well made enough to be an alternative to WoW.
WoW PvP is going the wrong direction for many. I want large scale and/or open world PvP to be the focus, not deathmatching (DM) in a small room. AoC may offer that.
If AoC is a good game, I honestly don't want it to get as big as WoW. Let's face it, as WoW has grown the community has degraded to the cess pool status it's at now. It seems that most of the people who have the most invested in WoW are the most beligerent of this new breed of player. Hopefully, they stay in WoW so that the new communities in AoC and WAR can be more like WoW was in it's first year.
WoW PvP is going the wrong direction for many. I want large scale and/or open world PvP to be the focus, not deathmatching (DM) in a small room. AoC may offer that.
If AoC is a good game, I honestly don't want it to get as big as WoW. Let's face it, as WoW has grown the community has degraded to the cess pool status it's at now. It seems that most of the people who have the most invested in WoW are the most beligerent of this new breed of player. Hopefully, they stay in WoW so that the new communities in AoC and WAR can be more like WoW was in it's first year.
# posted by : 3/5/08 15:47
: 3/5/08 15:47
It seems that most of the people who have the most invested in WoW are the most beligerent of this new breed of player. Hopefully,
No its just that the people that have the most time invested in thier characters have spent 3 years of grinds and frustration and slow content releases and it's starting to show. Add that to the big push to PVP and Solo content and blizzard is breaking thier community in the hope they can keep em playing 6 months longer till the next expansion.
Its really sad the most fun I've heard people talk about in the last few years has always been stuff like the Halloween bosses, the invasion and the few tiny drops of fun content they've thrown in from time to time. If they just had one team of 2 or 3 people that did nothing but minor content like that say once a month, I think much of that angst and hate would evaporate.
But instead you have people with 3 years invested in a character and relationships built that are logging into a game that is no longer fun for them. But to leave would be to admit all that time was now over done with and was just a fun diversion.
No its just that the people that have the most time invested in thier characters have spent 3 years of grinds and frustration and slow content releases and it's starting to show. Add that to the big push to PVP and Solo content and blizzard is breaking thier community in the hope they can keep em playing 6 months longer till the next expansion.
Its really sad the most fun I've heard people talk about in the last few years has always been stuff like the Halloween bosses, the invasion and the few tiny drops of fun content they've thrown in from time to time. If they just had one team of 2 or 3 people that did nothing but minor content like that say once a month, I think much of that angst and hate would evaporate.
But instead you have people with 3 years invested in a character and relationships built that are logging into a game that is no longer fun for them. But to leave would be to admit all that time was now over done with and was just a fun diversion.
Honestly, I'm not going to be playing AoC despite WoW; I'm going to be playing it because of WoW.
If I hadn't gotten into Warcraft, I wouldn't be doing the MMO thing at all. And I am far more interested in the world of Conan than the world of Warcraft; I love the Conan stories.
If I hadn't gotten into Warcraft, I wouldn't be doing the MMO thing at all. And I am far more interested in the world of Conan than the world of Warcraft; I love the Conan stories.
# posted by : 3/5/08 18:24
: 3/5/08 18:24
WoW is dead for me. All that money pouring into Blizzard's coffers and all they put out was Burning Crusade. WoW seems to be evolving into 2v2 and 5v5 dueling. EQ2 is on their 4th or 5th expansion and was released at the same time as WoW. It's bug free but no one seems to care. I am playing the better version of AoC (not the open one). Funcom is only giving themselves extra problems by using a variety of betas.
# posted by : 3/5/08 20:03
: 3/5/08 20:03
The minor technical glitches cannot count against the game here. I don't care what you think you know about what will happen at release - this is a beta, and it's unfair to judge it in any other way.
Better to ask some questions that you can legitimately answer now: do you like the combat system? The art direction? The classes? The setting? For me, all of those answers are "yes," though I can legitimately understand why people would feel otherwise.
Regardless, I don't think Tobold is exactly an impartial observer here. Games like WoW are hard to walk away from - they take so much time, that abandoning them for anything else feels like losing an investment. They warp the perspective of the players, who end up rationalizing their decision to "stand by their game" by not even giving any other games a chance.
This is, incidentally, why EverQuest still exists, and it's why making a dent in WoW's subscription numbers will be insanely difficult. AoC may be better than WoW, but it's clearly not *enough* better to steal away many true WoW fanboys.
Better to ask some questions that you can legitimately answer now: do you like the combat system? The art direction? The classes? The setting? For me, all of those answers are "yes," though I can legitimately understand why people would feel otherwise.
Regardless, I don't think Tobold is exactly an impartial observer here. Games like WoW are hard to walk away from - they take so much time, that abandoning them for anything else feels like losing an investment. They warp the perspective of the players, who end up rationalizing their decision to "stand by their game" by not even giving any other games a chance.
This is, incidentally, why EverQuest still exists, and it's why making a dent in WoW's subscription numbers will be insanely difficult. AoC may be better than WoW, but it's clearly not *enough* better to steal away many true WoW fanboys.
That's just the thing, I'm soooo bored to death of WoW, with its cartoony 90's-era graphics, lack of world immersion and unfunny kitsch. I don't think Blizzard even tries to care about lore anymore, everything is a transparent parody of popstars and inside-jokes. Not that the pseudo-Warhammer-meets-Tolkein story ever thrilled me anyway.
I was super pleased to experience it in 2004, Blizzard raised the bar so much at first. I thought it was a thrill ride, taking a gryphon flight path for the first time and playing essentially a much-improved EQ. But since then Blizzard has coasted into tedium. They've done so little for the game and spend most of their energy hedging into player-whining acceptance, back-and-forth balancing or cheap thrills like flying mounts that add nothing to the essential gameplay.
I quit WoW in December, it just became such a chore to bother logging in anymore.
When you switched to LOTRO that made sense to me. When you switched back after a decent patch it made sense too, but for me I just can't handle playing in a world anymore that I find so transparent and boring, especially when the best designers clearly aren't interested in taking any risks to improve it anymore. Blizzard is bleeding out their entertainment at a snail's pace.
I wouldn't have cared if AoC was exactly WoW in a different environment (ala LOTRO, heh), the changes to gameplay are just an exciting bonus. What I really wanted was to get away from the world of Azeroth and I've realized a hundredfold that their universe wouldn't entertain me as a movie, tv series or novels at all. But Robert E. Howard's Cthulu-esque mixed-up-history ramblings seem like the perfect online setting for me (I'll pass on the crappy Arnold movies mind you).
If you still prefer WoW, stick with it. I don't know why you're bothering to review a beta though, because it ~is~ a stress test beta, so I see the excuses the other way around on your end.
I was super pleased to experience it in 2004, Blizzard raised the bar so much at first. I thought it was a thrill ride, taking a gryphon flight path for the first time and playing essentially a much-improved EQ. But since then Blizzard has coasted into tedium. They've done so little for the game and spend most of their energy hedging into player-whining acceptance, back-and-forth balancing or cheap thrills like flying mounts that add nothing to the essential gameplay.
I quit WoW in December, it just became such a chore to bother logging in anymore.
When you switched to LOTRO that made sense to me. When you switched back after a decent patch it made sense too, but for me I just can't handle playing in a world anymore that I find so transparent and boring, especially when the best designers clearly aren't interested in taking any risks to improve it anymore. Blizzard is bleeding out their entertainment at a snail's pace.
I wouldn't have cared if AoC was exactly WoW in a different environment (ala LOTRO, heh), the changes to gameplay are just an exciting bonus. What I really wanted was to get away from the world of Azeroth and I've realized a hundredfold that their universe wouldn't entertain me as a movie, tv series or novels at all. But Robert E. Howard's Cthulu-esque mixed-up-history ramblings seem like the perfect online setting for me (I'll pass on the crappy Arnold movies mind you).
If you still prefer WoW, stick with it. I don't know why you're bothering to review a beta though, because it ~is~ a stress test beta, so I see the excuses the other way around on your end.
# posted by : 3/5/08 22:08
: 3/5/08 22:08
After being in betas and participating in launches for lots of mmorpg's, starting with EQ back in '99, I think Funcom's open beta is qualitatively different so far than quite a few other successful mmorpg's. I think there's definitely cause for concern based on a couple days in open beta.
WoW was light years ahead of where AoC is in beta, a month before launch. DAoC launched very smoothly. LoTRO launched smoothly and performed much better in beta than the AoC I've seen over the last couple days. There is a definable standard for good performance in beta a month before release, and AoC ain't hitting it yet.
Sure, it's a stress test, sure it might get better, but Funcom's started on a real down note for open beta. They're going to have to work to convince me that it's worth giving them my money now, when I was pretty sure I was interested before I actually played the game.
WoW was light years ahead of where AoC is in beta, a month before launch. DAoC launched very smoothly. LoTRO launched smoothly and performed much better in beta than the AoC I've seen over the last couple days. There is a definable standard for good performance in beta a month before release, and AoC ain't hitting it yet.
Sure, it's a stress test, sure it might get better, but Funcom's started on a real down note for open beta. They're going to have to work to convince me that it's worth giving them my money now, when I was pretty sure I was interested before I actually played the game.
# posted by : 3/5/08 22:37
: 3/5/08 22:37
That seems like a pretty selective memory to me, because every beta I recall all had significant problems which each and every time people cry out that it'll be a disaster.
It's either a disaster or it isn't, but I've yet to see much of a correlation with betas right up to the release, especially when it comes to stress tests rather than promotional betas (note how much smoother the promotional PvP beta was).
Let's face it, the only relatively smooth MMO launches have been LOTRO and City of Heroes.
The real tell-tale signs come from company status if a game significantly off track and I just don't see Funcom in a hurting state like say... Sigil (for an easy cheap shot, or I could say Ion Storm).
I'd totally grant if people don't trust Funcom from Anarchy Online's problematic release, but I see that two ways, because they pulled that one out of the fire and certainly survived.
It's either a disaster or it isn't, but I've yet to see much of a correlation with betas right up to the release, especially when it comes to stress tests rather than promotional betas (note how much smoother the promotional PvP beta was).
Let's face it, the only relatively smooth MMO launches have been LOTRO and City of Heroes.
The real tell-tale signs come from company status if a game significantly off track and I just don't see Funcom in a hurting state like say... Sigil (for an easy cheap shot, or I could say Ion Storm).
I'd totally grant if people don't trust Funcom from Anarchy Online's problematic release, but I see that two ways, because they pulled that one out of the fire and certainly survived.
# posted by : 3/5/08 22:52
: 3/5/08 22:52
Regardless, I don't think Tobold is exactly an impartial observer here. Games like WoW are hard to walk away from - they take so much time, that abandoning them for anything else feels like losing an investment. They warp the perspective of the players, who end up rationalizing their decision to "stand by their game" by not even giving any other games a chance.
I never even claimed impartiality. You are totally correct in observing that for most potential AoC players their relation with WoW dominates their view of other games. But that works in both directions, look at how many commenters said they just want to play AoC because they are bored of WoW.
I've heard that Funcom isn't using the best available client version for the open beta, which is either dumb, or has some hidden reason, like the newer client not being able to stand so many players. But reread my post, I'm mentioning the bugs, but they aren't the reason why I'm not excited about AoC. It's the gameplay which is sameish to everything else which doesn't convince me.
I never even claimed impartiality. You are totally correct in observing that for most potential AoC players their relation with WoW dominates their view of other games. But that works in both directions, look at how many commenters said they just want to play AoC because they are bored of WoW.
I've heard that Funcom isn't using the best available client version for the open beta, which is either dumb, or has some hidden reason, like the newer client not being able to stand so many players. But reread my post, I'm mentioning the bugs, but they aren't the reason why I'm not excited about AoC. It's the gameplay which is sameish to everything else which doesn't convince me.
It's the gameplay which is sameish to everything else which doesn't convince me.
That sounds like just about every other MMORPG out there (not to mention other types of entertainment), and it may also be effected by you playing the beginning parts of the game, and not the end parts of the game where some more differences will come into play.
That sounds like just about every other MMORPG out there (not to mention other types of entertainment), and it may also be effected by you playing the beginning parts of the game, and not the end parts of the game where some more differences will come into play.
Assuming the market for level-driven MMORPG's is pretty much limited to the people playing now it makes perfect business sense for Funcom to create a "same-ish" playing experience. Since Blizzard is riding a billion dollar a year money train they must be doing something right, and offering something similar (and of course slighty better in Funcom's view) is one way to get a piece of that pie.
Trying to revolutionize the genre is all fine and dandy as long as you have unlimited resources and no share holders. For most companies its just too risky.
So i wasnt expecting any earth shattering changes from AoC. Nor will i from any other MMORPG in the near future.
I think only the really dedicated players will feel they invested too much in their WoW character to switch games. If you play casually and strictly see it as a passtime (such as myself) you wont care. I ditched my UO toon without problems after a few years when WoW (then perceived as better) came along. I think this goes for all real casuals.
Trying to revolutionize the genre is all fine and dandy as long as you have unlimited resources and no share holders. For most companies its just too risky.
So i wasnt expecting any earth shattering changes from AoC. Nor will i from any other MMORPG in the near future.
I think only the really dedicated players will feel they invested too much in their WoW character to switch games. If you play casually and strictly see it as a passtime (such as myself) you wont care. I ditched my UO toon without problems after a few years when WoW (then perceived as better) came along. I think this goes for all real casuals.
# posted by : 4/5/08 14:54
: 4/5/08 14:54
Well, what you seem to forget is not surprising at all: the whole PvP focus, with player-built cities, PvP castles, mounted combat, open PvP (you can even kill guild members), no forced coalitions or language bareers - it'll be way more political, and unlike TR that also had open PvP but no infrastructure that made it worthwhile, PvP in AoC seems to actually have purpose.
That alone is enough to convince me that for me, who plays almost exclusively PvP now in WoW, the game can't be worse-suited.
The bugs you mentioned, it seems that the open beta client is the closed beta client from some months ago, for whatever reason, and thus has bugs that are meanwhile squashed in the closed beta client. It's what I heard only of course, because I don't wanna spoil my launch experience with premature looks into unfinished zones :)
That alone is enough to convince me that for me, who plays almost exclusively PvP now in WoW, the game can't be worse-suited.
The bugs you mentioned, it seems that the open beta client is the closed beta client from some months ago, for whatever reason, and thus has bugs that are meanwhile squashed in the closed beta client. It's what I heard only of course, because I don't wanna spoil my launch experience with premature looks into unfinished zones :)
One curiosity to me is that, in response to a game being "not different enough" from WoW, the solution is to simply continue playing WoW.
It's worth remembering that WoW was very similar to EverQuest, yet it dominated the market by being a clearly better version of the same. AoC isn't raising the bar for the genre the way that WoW did at its release, but simply being "like WoW" or "like EQ" shouldn't be much of a mark against it. There's something to be said for taking elements that are known to work and building off of those.
It's worth remembering that WoW was very similar to EverQuest, yet it dominated the market by being a clearly better version of the same. AoC isn't raising the bar for the genre the way that WoW did at its release, but simply being "like WoW" or "like EQ" shouldn't be much of a mark against it. There's something to be said for taking elements that are known to work and building off of those.
I hope my computer can actually run it, lol.
AoC looks exciting to me because a few reasons
~adult theme, less kiddies in community
~violence, is there ever enough?
~open pvp, great for players who advance content too fast
~promising class/combat system
~"new" game to learn
~its conan
Coming from WoW, Lineage 2, Everquest and other MMOrpgs I think AoC will be a good one.
~tenmohican
AoC looks exciting to me because a few reasons
~adult theme, less kiddies in community
~violence, is there ever enough?
~open pvp, great for players who advance content too fast
~promising class/combat system
~"new" game to learn
~its conan
Coming from WoW, Lineage 2, Everquest and other MMOrpgs I think AoC will be a good one.
~tenmohican
# posted by : 4/5/08 23:44
: 4/5/08 23:44
From what I read and understand, AoC targets the people who want a different, but fantasy setting and wants to especially take care of the people who (like the poster above me) are interested in...
- gore
- sieges
- blood
- mutilation
- boobs
All in all, despite the beautiful graphics (which I already have in LOTRO, thanks Turbine) and the depth in PvP, not a game for me after all.
- gore
- sieges
- blood
- mutilation
- boobs
All in all, despite the beautiful graphics (which I already have in LOTRO, thanks Turbine) and the depth in PvP, not a game for me after all.
Gore, blood, mutilation and boobs aren't selling points for me, but I'm also not offended by them either.
Sieges on the other hand, well I typically avoid PvP but what I've seen of them so far could lure me in.
Mounted combat? Adore the idea, it looks amazing too. Guild cities? Woot! Polearm combos that don't look like I'm just whacking with a stick: Great. I love the animation of this game, I love the setting, it has won me over. I'd hardly call myself a fanboi, but I've made the choice over which game I'd prefer to play.
Sieges on the other hand, well I typically avoid PvP but what I've seen of them so far could lure me in.
Mounted combat? Adore the idea, it looks amazing too. Guild cities? Woot! Polearm combos that don't look like I'm just whacking with a stick: Great. I love the animation of this game, I love the setting, it has won me over. I'd hardly call myself a fanboi, but I've made the choice over which game I'd prefer to play.
# posted by : 5/5/08 13:54
: 5/5/08 13:54
~adult theme, less kiddies in community
It amazes me that adults who were once teenagers really think in a game this is possible. The more it's advertised as an adult community the more teens will come. And boobs always draw teens like moths to the flame.
It amazes me that adults who were once teenagers really think in a game this is possible. The more it's advertised as an adult community the more teens will come. And boobs always draw teens like moths to the flame.
One of the biggest reasons WoW is popular is because it can run on vintage pc systems.
If every mmo gamer in the world owned a top of the line rig, what mmo would they chose to play?
seregul
- retired WoW after 2 years
- currently in LoTRO
- testing Aoc
- waiting for WAR
If every mmo gamer in the world owned a top of the line rig, what mmo would they chose to play?
seregul
- retired WoW after 2 years
- currently in LoTRO
- testing Aoc
- waiting for WAR
# posted by : 5/5/08 16:46
: 5/5/08 16:46
Well, when some formula tried and tested works, who will diverge from it?
Groundbreaking is awesome but not that much lucrative. A new MMOG with substantially different gameplay and features from the norm would probalby tank regardless of it's quality. Too much of an assle to learn new moves anyway.
That is why WoW succeeded: because is a polished dumbed-down version of Everquest.
Groundbreaking is awesome but not that much lucrative. A new MMOG with substantially different gameplay and features from the norm would probalby tank regardless of it's quality. Too much of an assle to learn new moves anyway.
That is why WoW succeeded: because is a polished dumbed-down version of Everquest.
Tobald said "But unless you are bored of World of Warcraft, I can't think of any compelling reason to play AoC instead of WoW. You would really need to absolutely love some of the new features to make you willing to overlook the bugs and shortcomings of AoC."
I don't know Tobald, I'm not reaching your conclusion based on your review. You concede better graphics, better leveling and better combat, but conclude that these do not overcome the bugs and "shortcomings" of AoC.
But I went back and reread your review, and you don't list a single shortcoming except for bugs. So what is it that you didn't like about AoC? So far I'm only hearing positives. I look forward to future posts by you.
Sammy
I don't know Tobald, I'm not reaching your conclusion based on your review. You concede better graphics, better leveling and better combat, but conclude that these do not overcome the bugs and "shortcomings" of AoC.
But I went back and reread your review, and you don't list a single shortcoming except for bugs. So what is it that you didn't like about AoC? So far I'm only hearing positives. I look forward to future posts by you.
Sammy
# posted by : 5/5/08 22:29
: 5/5/08 22:29
I think I understand what tobold is saying. I tryed EQ2 a while back. The graphics were better, the starting area for the dark side was awesome. But the UI annoyed me. I hated little things like opening and closing doors. If I'd had friends in the game i probably would have worked through that and stayed. Overall it was a pretty solid fun game. But I uninstalled it and went back to the game and friends I knew. That is the obstacle any new game that wants to get big numbers has to fight. You have to pull whole groups of people. Which means things like system specs being too high become even more problamatic. One or 2 people who can't play your game could keep an entire guild who'd come over from even trying it.
Ew, EQ2 was fugly, the only way I'd call it better graphics are in relation to EQ.
SOE's art dept. leaves a lot to be desired.
SOE's art dept. leaves a lot to be desired.
# posted by : 6/5/08 00:59
: 6/5/08 00:59
First, at launch, WoW was not only the same buggy mess as every other mmo, it was far less complete than AoC- some classes didn't even have their feat trees completed! And what about all the incomplete, broken quests, server resets,etc.
Second, if everyone who loves mmo's adopted Tobold's attitude, no other mmo would succeed, because getting a game to WoW's level of polish and debugging is simply impossible- the developers would run out of cash before they could get it to launch- it's an unrealistic, unsustainable expectation. If players aren't willing to accept a moderate level of imperfection at launch, then we're all stuck with WoW forever.
That said, I do agree with some of the complaints of sameness. If AoC devolves into a "mini-game PvP" grind, then I won't be playing it for long. If open world PvP remains steady and robust, I'll be with it for much longer.
To me, people who continue to play WoW after this long, are incompetent consumers: to continue to pour money into Blizzard's coffers is rewarding non-innovation and letting them get away with really piss-poor product development. With the money they've made, Burning Crusades should have been so much more. I get the grind/time-sink monthly-subscription business model, I just refuse to tolerate it at the ridiculous extreme WoW takes it to. I expect a more varied experience for my $.
The reason I'm glad WoW is still around is that it is now a repository for the carebears and Barrens Chat-types, and will allow the rest of us to (hopefully) enjoy the new mmo's that will (hopefully) thrive with dedicated, but smaller followings.
Second, if everyone who loves mmo's adopted Tobold's attitude, no other mmo would succeed, because getting a game to WoW's level of polish and debugging is simply impossible- the developers would run out of cash before they could get it to launch- it's an unrealistic, unsustainable expectation. If players aren't willing to accept a moderate level of imperfection at launch, then we're all stuck with WoW forever.
That said, I do agree with some of the complaints of sameness. If AoC devolves into a "mini-game PvP" grind, then I won't be playing it for long. If open world PvP remains steady and robust, I'll be with it for much longer.
To me, people who continue to play WoW after this long, are incompetent consumers: to continue to pour money into Blizzard's coffers is rewarding non-innovation and letting them get away with really piss-poor product development. With the money they've made, Burning Crusades should have been so much more. I get the grind/time-sink monthly-subscription business model, I just refuse to tolerate it at the ridiculous extreme WoW takes it to. I expect a more varied experience for my $.
The reason I'm glad WoW is still around is that it is now a repository for the carebears and Barrens Chat-types, and will allow the rest of us to (hopefully) enjoy the new mmo's that will (hopefully) thrive with dedicated, but smaller followings.
# posted by : 6/5/08 08:48
: 6/5/08 08:48
You have totally ignored and dismissed a great deal of positives for AoC. Excellent voice acting, generally excellent quests (particularily in the Destiny line), buffs that last for hours rather then minutes, and quite a few other very nice details.
In the beta, I believe that a great deal of the lag that you are encountering is caused by two things... First, the resource files are not optimized; textures and models are pulled from all over some very large data libraries. Secondly, if your computers hard drives are fragmented, that, coupled with the first problem of resource optimization would result in some very poor load times.
All that said, yeah, I do think that launch is going to have some rough days. But so did WoW and most other titles.
In the beta, I believe that a great deal of the lag that you are encountering is caused by two things... First, the resource files are not optimized; textures and models are pulled from all over some very large data libraries. Secondly, if your computers hard drives are fragmented, that, coupled with the first problem of resource optimization would result in some very poor load times.
All that said, yeah, I do think that launch is going to have some rough days. But so did WoW and most other titles.
# posted by : 6/5/08 22:06
: 6/5/08 22:06
" sam said...
~adult theme, less kiddies in community
It amazes me that adults who were once teenagers really think in a game this is possible. The more it's advertised as an adult community the more teens will come. And boobs always draw teens like moths to the flame."
Things are different when even the parents of the kids playing the game wont pay for it. WoW, sure the parents might say its ok.. Age of Conan, many more parents will say no to the monthly charges/buying the game.
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~adult theme, less kiddies in community
It amazes me that adults who were once teenagers really think in a game this is possible. The more it's advertised as an adult community the more teens will come. And boobs always draw teens like moths to the flame."
Things are different when even the parents of the kids playing the game wont pay for it. WoW, sure the parents might say its ok.. Age of Conan, many more parents will say no to the monthly charges/buying the game.
# posted by : 7/5/08 18:28
: 7/5/08 18:28<< Home
