Tobold's Blog
Saturday, November 21, 2009
 
Thought for the day: Persistence part 2

Even a MMORPG ends one day, either by us quitting or by the servers shutting down. If we don't play to enjoy the moment, but play to achieve a certain level and quality of gear, what exactly remains from all of our efforts the day the servers shut down?
Comments:
A friends list?
 
Nothing. As nothing remains after we are dead and everybody who remembers us.

There is no purpose in MMOs, as there is no purpose in Real Life.

Still, we can have fun, can we not ?
 
And of course, it is well known that He Who Dies With The Most Toys Wins™.
 
Information remains. We are smarter than before (if not, we wasted our time and are dumb).
 
screenshots, videos, blogs...
 
We are left with the memories, experiences, and as Harry said, with the friends we made.

@Nils, RL has no purpose and nothing after death? You are assuming there is no Heaven/Hell, no afterlife or re-incarnation. While an assumption of "nothing after" is as valid as all of the above (given the lack of evidence), it is not a known fact, so it could be wrong :)

Too bad there's no re-incarnation or similar thing for virtual characters :)
 
@SolidState:

RL has no purpose and nothing after death? You are assuming there is no Heaven/Hell, no afterlife or re-incarnation. While an assumption of "nothing after" is as valid as all of the above (given the lack of evidence), it is not a known fact, so it could be wrong :)

And every fantasy, as incredible and as stupid as they come to your mind, is as probable as a heaven/hell in the absence of evidence.

I prefer
http://en.wikipedia.or/wiki/Occam%27s_razor


When competing hypotheses are equal in other respects, the principle recommends selection of the hypothesis that introduces the fewest assumptions and postulates the fewest entities while still sufficiently answering the question. It is in this sense that Occam's razor is usually understood. To quote Isaac Newton, "we are to admit no more causes of natural things than such as are both true and sufficient to explain their appearances. Therefore, to the same natural effects we must, so far as possible, assign the same causes."


:)
 
Most things end, that's not a special property of MMOs. All we can do is have fun while we can and perhaps along the way leave with some knowledge and friends which will make the next place more fun as well.
 
I think you are over simplifying Tobold. I suspect that for those with an achiever mentality "enjoying the moment" actually means striving for the best gear even if you never actually get it.
 
@SolidState - their IS reincarnation for our virtual characters. We the players are the spirit that gives life to our virtual characters. As such when we roll a character in the Next Big MMO we take all the knowledge, experience, and memory of our previous character into a whole new world.

The experiences we have with our friends and loved ones both real and virtual are what give meaning to our real and virtual lives - certainly the implication is that epics and real life material wealth are a tool, and not an end into themselves, and pursueing them for their own sake can only lead to misery in the end.
 
Hmmm, my first online game was MTGO, while I haven't been back there in years now, I still play other games with a friend or two I made there, and read the blogging of others.

The first MMO I truly got into was Asheron's call 2, now dead for years. Again, the game is gone, but I still run around in world of warcraft with some of the friends there.

Like any other leisure activity, you take the experiences, the fun memories, and hopefully a few friends you made along the way, seems a fair trade for your time.

That said, yeah getting too attached to your standing, or gear in game could make the end tough, try to remember it's there for fun, not to build a legacy.
 
@SolidState There is reincarnation for our characters, simply pick a new game. And unlike theories of real world past lives, you get to keep your memories and friends and start over in a whole new world.

Also, whether or not you believe in anything after death, the effects you had on those around persist, and continue. As true in a virtual world as the real one, perhaps in someways more so, those worlds are often designed so you can have a forceful impact on someone elses time.
 
A friends list?

But how large and how deep would your friends list be if you purely played to achieve levels and gear, rather than to enjoy the game? People have joined and left my guild when we've been actively raiding, but most of the ones who I count as friends are the ones who have been around when we weren't successful and progressing, but rather just playing for enjoyment.
 
I think it's a bit early to assume that the servers will shut down. I started MMOs in the year I turned 41. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see some MMOs we play now lasting longer than I do.

We have T.V. and radio series that are more than half a century old. Comics that are pushing 70. We have characters in popular culture that reincarnate for centuries. I can imagine Everquest or EVE still being around in some form in 30 years time, let alone WoW.

If it still makes good money, why would it stop?
 
If we don't play to enjoy the moment, but play to achieve a certain level and quality of gear, what exactly remains from all of our efforts the day the servers shut down?

The same thing that happens after the next expansion hits.
 
Why play games at all? If they aren't fun, why bother?

I don't waste my time playing games that aren't fun. Don't let yourself be baited by "It gets fun at level 25!"
 
The main thing left is all the weight gained from sitting and staring at a screen for too much time!
 
I think it's a bit early to assume that the servers will shut down.

Earth & Beyond, Auto Assault, Tabula Rasa, Hellfire, MMORPGs shutting down is not an assumption but something that already happened in the past. Of course how long a game will be around depends on its commercial success. But even games that were highly successful in their time, like UO and EQ, now have a lot less subscribers and might die out in the long run.
 
Reincarnation or not, but on a serious note – wouldn't Blizzard be underutilising their huge installed base's commercial potential if they didn't offer some sort of carrot to WoW players moving to their next online venture? I wouldn't expect epics or faster levelling (which would probably lessen the initial experience), but pets and fancy dresses or even a pretty guild hall... why not?
 
Well, exactly, why play for gear and all that when the servers will shut down one day? I'm always scratching my head over that one.

See, with a game that ends, it makes sense. It's like climbing a mountain. Once you've done it, you can say you've done it. It's a life accomplishment.

But you guys who want a game that never ends - your mountain never ends!!! You never accomplish anything except progress up a mounain that doesn't stop. It's like that guy in hell who pushes a boulder up a hill and always just before he gets to the top, it rolls down again.

I don't know why your into the whole 'endless' thing? And why your into end game, instead of the game ending?

Hmmm, I think I'll post this on my blog as well...
 
Stories, memories, and some true friends :)
 
But you don't need hell to get those
 
I remain. The other players remain. The past remains. What we did, who we were, what we felt - this is what remains, this is what nobody can take away from us. We can look at each other and go "Remember when ...?" - "Yeah. Good times."
 
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