Tobold's Blog
Friday, January 20, 2012
I'll just let Rohan blog for me

Don't you hate it when you are thinking about a blog post and then see it already written by somebody else before you get to writing it? I fully agree with Rohan on SWTOR needing a Dungeon Finder. Just like his SWTOR character, my character hasn't done nearly as many flashpoints as I would have liked, because of the lack of a Dungeon Finder functionality. As groups form in chat in the fleet, and you don't hear that chat if you are elsewhere, you can only either twiddle your thumbs in the fleet waiting for a group, or go questing and miss out on flashpoints. Really stupid system!
But, but... social fabric! Accountability! What of the children?!

...or something like that.
Welcome to vanilla WoW :)
No point in flogging a dead horse, I'm surprised people are still logging in to be honest. It'll be dead by the end of the year.
You could of course enlist yourself on the LFG, and quest on, then wait for someone forming a group to contact you... That is, of course, unless wow's system hasn't totally scared you away from communicating with your fellow players. ^^
Sounds like they just blindly copied Vanilla WoW there? I never understood why I couldn't just enter the LFG-Chatchannel at will (and maybe even filter to only receive stuff from a certain level range).
The choice not to have a global LFG channel is idiotic. LOTRO made the same mistake.

What astonishes me though is that if you can't heard chat past a zone border, the only solution in a post-wow-lfgrief finder world is an anonymous cross-server instant transport dungeon matcher.

Wouldn't it make more sense to put you in a global LFG channel if you flag for LFG? (This also has the advantage that there's no reason that couldn't be implemented, well, immediately.)
I agree, there is a lot of middle ground.

For instance, what about a system where you flag yourself for level-appropriate dungeons, which enters you into a global LFG channel where you only see messages from people who are also flagged for one of your dungeons?
To me, no game has handled LFG better than FFXI. The system there is a globally viewable listing of everyone currently looking for a group. When you flag LFG you have the option to throw in a note as well to include things like spec and gear level etc. Fantastic system, made forming groups very easy; the only way better would probably be LFD where you don't have to do anything but queue.
The thing about chat channels is that people start using them for non-lfg chat. Then it becomes very spammy and the signal-to-noise ratio becomes very weak.

Not to mention that I had to turn off general chat yesterday because people were posting spoilers in Dromund Kaas general chat. That's an extra downside for SWTOR chat, because stories are so important.

That was how WoW managed their LFD tool in Lich King up until the full tool launched in 3.3. It worked pretty well in there too but some servers had huge imbalances.

I've played 2 characters to 50 and never done a heroic 4 quest past level 20, there just isn't anyone around. No one, on any planet, every groups for flashpoints and standing on the fleet for an hour is no fun.

BW had these metrics in beta and has them again right now. Without a dev talking to players, no one can guess what they are trying to do.
so actually you do want a solo game, but only for flashpoint you like to pug it anonymously without having to interact at all.
I'd support a LFD tool if it were restricted to your server. It only becomes a problem, socially speaking, when it's cross server.
I think a tool makes a lot more sense for the level up dungeons that's for sure. For the end game ones, I think it depends on implementation. WoW's in Cata seemed to practically incentivize not running with people you knew, and I'm not sure that's for the best.

A lot of people have talked about the tool from a solo person's point of view or from a server community point of view, but I haven't heard much from a guild point of view. Any thoughts there?
You might consider joining a guild if you like group content. With guild mates and occasional pick up adds, it has been easy to run all the FP and heroics.

I also agree a DF would be nice.
but only for flashpoint you like to pug it anonymously without having to interact at all.

Huh? What does having a dungeon finder have to do with the degree of interaction you have with the other people in your group? I found a lot of new friends over the years in random groups. And a random group is a lot more social than playing just with my NPC companion.

If you think that it is either the dungeon finder feature or the cross-server nature that makes people behave badly in groups, you are sadly mistaken. People can be nice to each other even with them, and be completely beastly to each other in games where you can only group with people from your own server you met in chat.
The social with a cross-server LFG tool is that you're not likely to ever run across the person. So there's no real downside to being a ninja for example. And there's not much upside to interacting with your fellow players. It's your only window of interaction.

A same server LFD would be awesome, facilitating finding groups while allowing for social incentives. In pre-LFG tool WoW guilds and word-of-mouth were ways to police jerks.

It's just so much fun to see both you and Nils jump on the LFG bandwagon....

Honestly, it's been clear from the start that the feature was total win, allowing people to actually run the instances without waiting for hours in town spamming channels.....
Helistar, your comments would be more appreciated if they had any base in reality. I have ALWAYS been defending the LFD function of WoW, and repeatedly asked for a LFR feature long before Blizzard implemented it. Please don't confuse me with Nils!
LFD, LFR and any and all anonymous/random grouping tools need to die in my considered opinion.

What we need (in my opinion) is good non-anonymous grouping tool a la DDO.

For anonymous/random groups to succeed with any frequency, the content needs to be nerfed to the ground -- which makes running it with people who kind-of know what they are doing an exercise in soul-destroying boredom.
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