I like to think we could take the LOTR licence away and still have a great MMO - that's certainly what we are aiming for.

Yeah, I think he's right about that. What little I saw of LOTRO seemed very polished and accessable; much like my first impression of WoW.
 

if Blizzard ain't implementing palyer-housing before LOTRO they will lose a lot more than they want.
after all, orcs bashing or orcs bashing, a huge difference :p
 

LOTRO is fine, and if it had come out before WOW, I'd probably have played for a few months. But it didn't, and as prety as it is - it's a pain in the arse to get to grips with. The worst in game map I've ever come across, the design of areas doesn't feel 'easy' and I'm lost almost permanently. Small things, but build up frustration to the point were I simply cant get involved - and give up after less than an hours play each time I try again. I want to like it, but can't.

WS
 

I don't get you people. You sit around and claim that LotRO is just like WoW.

Then you actually believe that people will leave WoW... just to go play a game that is like WoW? If players don't like The Burning Crusade because it's the "same ole WoW" then why on God's green earth would they pick up a game that is supposedly so like WoW!?!?!?

Now, I don't believe LotRO is anything like WoW. Outside of some very basic concepts there is nothing in LotRO that is as polished, fun, or fluid as WoW.

On another note; an expanded market means nothing. It never has. A classic example is the original Atari 2600. There were MILLIONS of units hiding in people's houses and the video game market still crashed! Have we not learned anything?
 

"Finally something where nobody can accuse them of copying WoW, Blizzard isn't exactly fast in adding new features to the game, we might be seeing player housing in LotRO before we see it in WoW."

Kudos to Turbine for a polished Beta.

Yet I'm not sure I'm quite ready to join Tobold in taking the leap that Turbine will be 'fast' just yet, since there is not a broad basis upon which to base either the speed of implementation or the promise of player housing at this point, except faith.

So, in fact, any MMO Beta had better be rather polished and finished and smooth, and you'd better offer at least as much capability and content as the competition (thus the WoW-clones), or an unfavorable comparison to the competition may torpedo your chances before you ever even release (though in this case the LOTR tie-in by itself is probably good for a lot for a lot of subscriptions). See the Vanguard Beta reviews, for example...

I've said it before; being in the software industry -- promises and delivery dates come easy.
So do schedule slips and bugs and "implementation delayed".

And in the realm of personal preference, if I was polled about direction of future development efforts, player housing would not even make my list of priorities. If Blizz has done their homework, perhaps the reason there is no player housing is that there is no demand for it, or more demand for other new content.

But then again, the new Armory may be the first step in a Blizz "player housing" capability...
 

And I didn't even cover the fact that my "bullshit meter" is flagging this talk from Turbine as EXTREME BULLSHIT.

They couldn't even do the promised content updates for D&DO. WTF does anyone think any of these features will get implemented in a timely manner... or get implemented at all? Show me, don't tell me.
 

Heartless... I don't think you're hearltess. No, I'm starting to think you're heart-broken. Or jaded maybe. Relax have a scone, and maybe a caffe mocha.
 

Oh, and sorry for the double-post, but on topic here...

I don't think LotRO will have to be a million seller, or even half of that. Turbine's biggest success this far had less than 100,000 subs right? I can easily see LotRO beating AC one in terms of the subscriber base, and it's clear that the game is way more polished and well received than DDO was and is. They've very likely got a hit on their hands.
 

it will be a mega-sellere simply because of the IP.
i mean, from a silly book (sorry, i love the book) a billion-dollar trilogy-movie made out of it which was not to be expected. at the moment the whole world knows what a mmorpg is, or at least they heard of...

i think the secret cash-cow level is in LOTRO.
 

According to MMOGChart Asheron's Call once had 120,000 players, and I do think that LotRO will easily beat that. I also think it will beat the *current* player level of Everquest, of 200,000, just based on the bigger size of the market nowadays. Anything beyond that is very hard to estimate.

Why would people buy a game which is very similar to WoW? Because by doing so they get new classes, a new tradeskill system, and a lot of other new features. The problem with Burning Crusade was that playing a level 70 priest is still the same as playing a level 60 priest. Playing a "minstrel" is noticeably different.

The idea that a new game has to be "better" for people to switch is inherently flawed. It is based on the wrong concept that people are looking for a MMORPG to play for the rest of their lives. While the life expectancy for a MMORPG is considerably longer than that of other video games, it isn't endless. Sometime "new and similar" is all that it takes.

But hey, everybody has the right to his opinion, and the unconditional negativism of Heartless on LotRO at least balances out the unconditional positivism of Bildo on that game. ;)
 

I guess the sheer numbers of subscribers is irrelevant so long as the game is profitable each month. I'm sure they know their never going to match WoW figures, just as the guys making Warhammer online do.

Being that Blizzard don't appear to be saying much about player housing, and Turbine has history of implementing a really nice housing system in AC (I miss idly sitting on the roof of my cottage near Baishi :( ), it is feasible that they may get housing online before Blizz. I don't see that would threaten Blizzard at all, though I wish it would and make them get working on housing asap :P
 

Anyone know what is the minimum spec to play lotRO? I'm playing WOW with just 32MB 3-D card, 2GB RAM and only 2.4G P4! Any idea if lotRO would need better 3-D card?
 

Retail Minimum Requirements:
Processor: Intel Pentium® 4 1.8 GHz or equivalent
Video: 64 MB NVIDIA® GeForce® 3 or ATI® Radeon® 8500
DirectX: DirectX® 9.0c
OS: Windows® XP
RAM: 512 MB
Disk Space: 7 GB available
Internet: 56kbps Modem
Optical Drive: 2x DVD-ROM

Might be worth getting a new GPU then. 32MB is rather low these days :|
 

I see LotRO as a fresh start. I joined wow almost a year after it came out, everyone already knew everything. Any quest I had trouble with was easily tthot'd. All the dungeons were already mapped and everyone knew the boss fights. Except for the the current raid dungeon, which I wasn't about to get into. I was doing the baron 45 minute run, the first time I ever did a baron run. Everything was new to me, but wasn't "new". Playing wow was like watching a rerun that you didn't see but had friends tell you about.

I'm gonna buy LotRO right away, I'm going to hop on the server with all the other noobs, and i'm gonna noob it up good. Sucks some people from beta are going to already have leveled characters.

Also, I did state I started wow a year into the game, thats kind of a lie, I started a week or so after release, got a horde warlock to level 11. I then stopped playing for about a year. This was my first MMO and trisfall glades was so damn cool. I liked doing super simple quests with a group of people and no one knew where anything was or how to do anything. I'm looking for that in LotRO.

As for the general community of WoW, I feel people are far to vested in their characters to just up and leave WoW. I'm sure many will try different MMO's, I'm also sure many will still keep their WoW accounts. This will probably be the case for years to come. Eventually due to graphics and content, WoW will die. No MMO in perticular is going to kill it though. WoW will die of old age, and maybe a broken heart due to the lack of people starting lvl 1 gnome alts to post on the forums with.
 

You hit the nail right on the head Crazyflanger.

I have been playing WOW for a year now and the main reason I will be trying LOTRO is because I too want to explore a new virtual world without knowing that my wildest questions can easily be answered via thottbot.

Score 2 points when you said people most likely won't be packing up and leaving WOW; I won't be. I will probably do what allot of other players will do: suspend their WOW account for a month or two, check out LOTRO, and then make a decision about whether or not I want to continue with LOTR or WOW.

/cheers to noobing it up
 

I'm a third who came late to the WoW party. Didn't get to WoW until about 9 months ago, and the feeling of being the only person in the party/guild who hasn't seen everything before isn't fun. Permanent noob status. Everything done by reading a faq about it online so as to not be worse than everyone else.

People can be ready for more of a WoW-like MMO and sick of WoW. There's plenty different in lotro: no cartooniness, stat-centricity, mediocre backstory/quest text, PVP/PVE balance issues, uber-hardcore raid game etc. And Tobold's right that WoW characters at 60 are basically the same at 70, with maybe one or two useful new skills to play with and mobs actually tuned harder so the characters feel less powerful and flexible.

Personally I'd bet that LOTRO gets at least 300,000 subs by the time of official launch. Depending on reviews, the higher level game and how TBC goes it could get into the high hundred thousands boxes sold, maybe even a million worldwide.
 

Then you actually believe that people will leave WoW... just to go play a game that is like WoW? If players don't like The Burning Crusade because it's the "same ole WoW" then why on God's green earth would they pick up a game that is supposedly so like WoW!?!?!?

Because a lot of players don't enjoy repetitive gameplay, such as raiding or faction grinding.

LOTRO offers a new world to explore, with new storylines, and new quest, and many of those quest will be soloable, or require no more than a partner to complete.

I don't expect the LOTRO endgame to be any different than the same old same old, but I'll have fun leveling up my character, anyway.

As long as a mmorpg can give me a few months of fun, that's good enough for me. I have very realistic and practical expectations, in that regard.

Maybe if Burning Crusade had offered new quest for all level ranges, instead of a 40 level gap in the middle, I would have gone back, but I have zero interest in slogging a new character through STV, or Un'Goro Crater no matter how much I enjoyed those zones.

Based on the little bit of LOTRO I played, I think it will do very well for itself.
 

I'd post my praise again here but the poster above says it perfectly.

I'm enjoying the beta precisely because it ISN'T WoW and, so far, mercifully "raid"-free.

Many people enjoy new mmorpgs precisely for the same reason they enjoy making alts. It's either a chance to start afresh or the fun of "the journey there" as opposed to the so-called end-game.

If truth be told, I wonder how many WoW players would say they actually enjoy/enjoyed the 60+ aspect of the game more than enjoyed first logging in and playing their toon through 59 levels.

Perhaps the part I've enjoyed most in LotRO beta is the sheer lack of information out there. No thottbot leading you by the nose to every quest /loc. No "best templates" locking in your character and actually having to dig around the forums or use trial and error to find the best way to do something.

Sure, a couple of the quests (with ultra-wooly directions dialogue) have left me frustrated, but what the heck? It's beta - and a very good one at that.
 

I have to agree that people would leave WOW even for a WOW-like game because it's new content and classes.

However, WOW has nothing to fear in the players they do lose, their base is too high. I think its EQ1 and EQ2 that will feel the loss more because the pace of LOTRO is more like an EQ game, and hence more appealing to them.

That thought makes me sad. There is real unlived potential in EQ2 that for reasons I've posted about before, never let them reach the audience levels they should have gained. I've tried going back more than once but there just enough of something elusive missing for me.
 

Heartless is the Yin to my Yang... or the other way around maybe?

Anyway, I'm a die-hard Tolkien fan, and this won't be the last time that I'll state that LotRO could be utter crap (which it's not, really) and I'd still be out there fighting the good fight for it.

Like Phil Harrison for Sony. :D
 

No, I don't think anyone seriously thinks that LOTRO is going to "hurt" WoW, but it might just save Turbine.

This is a studio that had a massive failure in AC2, and a very lackluster response to DDO.

They need a hit in a bad way, and LOTRO could be their last chance to stay a major player in an increasingly competitive market.
 

I agree that LOTRO won't hurt WOW that much out of the gate. A lot of the players the game will pick up dropped WOW months or years ago after hitting the level 60 raid grind; they're willing to put 3-6 months into leveling in any reasonably polished casual friendly MMO that comes along. Many more were hanging on with the idea that the expansion would change things and would have left TBC within a month or two anyway due to ennui.

By the end of the year, I think AOC/WAR/LOTRO as a group could put a sizable dent in the WOW population, especially if the entry level PVE endgame remains tuned the way it is and a magical fix for PVP/PVE balance isn't found. Not enough to herald the end of the game, after all WOW has 8.5 million players, but enough to flatten out the growth curve or even turn it around. More targeted games are the wave of the future now that the market has grown so large.
 

I've nearly stopped reading this blog since Tobold has become such a total LOTRO fanbio..its such an ugly game..
 

Playing WOW now for 2 years time has given me plenty of rewards (emotionally and virtual) and I really love my character (I tend to play less chars deep instead of many shallow). I like my guild and think I will play WOW for about 2-3 years time onwards still, as long as there are plenty nice people around and the game is still fun. I won't be investing much more soul into WOW anymore, though. I will keep playing it, in a relaxed style and meanwhile spend other evenings with other style. True shift from a raiding player to a casual gamer.

Where does LOTRO come into play? Well, the hook for me is the founder offer. I have enough money to buy me forever into LOTRO for about 200 EUR (50 EUR preorder / game and 150 the founder offer). Once I payed that, I can enjoy as much or as little LOTRO as I see fit. Whenever I want to play LOTRO and enjoy the differentness to WOW, I can log in.

Some of you may argue that this is a rather expensive way of having the freedom to choose between different playstyles and characters but thats my choosing.

I am also looking forward to Star Trek online (Tobold, I hope you will cover some of that, too when it comes up, you always find interviews and stuff that I cannot even think of digging it up on the Inet). That might be the only game which will truly cut largely into my WOW time budget.

Back to the interview topic: I look forward to housing (my own little hobbit hole, yes!) and the other features. I especially like the "monster play" idea, I think it is brilliant if executed in a fine manner by Turbine (no more "nerf class X in PvE because of PvP", one of my major hassles in WoW!). The other ideas, well, I generally like the LOTR setting, so it is going to be a wonderful chance to follow my EASK approach towards MMOPGS.

Last thing: I bet WOW account subscriptions are experiencing a dent now. They are currently offering "one month for free if you get your friends subscribing". That one is a clear marketing tool which comes into play when subscriptions (everywhere) are declining. I bet WOW is closer to 8 million now and falling. In our guild 2 hotshots (playing fast to level 70 and then wondering why the endgame is no more fun when they can't find people for the dungeons - sigh) will quit now and 3 other players will quit WOW completely for LOTRO. Of a 100 people guild thats a start of 5%, with some people playing less and less I would say another 5% are in risk of quitting. I know, bad statistics to begin with but who else experiences the same thing?
 

I've nearly stopped reading this blog since Tobold has become such a total LOTRO fanbio..its such an ugly game.

Hehe, better get out now. You can be sure that once I really started playing the retail version of LotRO, I'll write a lot more about it, and a lot less about WoW. It's the nature of this blog, I write about what I play.

But I'd be interested in your definition of "ugly". I found the graphics of LotRO prettier than those of WoW, especially the landscapes. Some of the animations, especially on the elves, look a bit silly, but combat in general doesn't look worse than WoW. So I'd really like to know why somebody would think of LotRO as "ugly".

Drugh said: Where does LOTRO come into play? Well, the hook for me is the founder offer. I have enough money to buy me forever into LOTRO for about 200 EUR (50 EUR preorder / game and 150 the founder offer). Once I payed that, I can enjoy as much or as little LOTRO as I see fit. Whenever I want to play LOTRO and enjoy the differentness to WOW, I can log in.

Same here.
 

I'm not sure if I'll switch to Lord of the Rings, but I am growing increasingly bored with WOW. I have two 70s (hunter and priest) and a 67 warrior. Right now, the option for the 70s is to raid and continue doing the same instances again and again, in order to gain slightly better gear. It's not terrible but neither is it very exciting. I started a blood elf and am having fun running through the starting areas, but can't imagine leveling her all the way up again.

Last night, I was considering canceling my account. I think one of WOW's major faults is its lack of attention of role-playing; the game focuses on characters being a bunch of stats, and the upper level game is all about those stats. I might as well stop my subscription and wait for the next expansion, since the time invested in the current minute increase in stats (as opposed to leveling and access to better items) is quite small. I did enjoy the new content, though of course I won't get to see all of it since I don't raid heavily.

Frankly, I'd want more than anything to play a Sporeggar or a Murloc, even if Blizzard puts a level cap to them.
 

Like Heartless, my bullshitmeter also goes off whenever Turbine talks about the future. They're notorious for announcing cool new stuff that never gets implemented or gets postponed again and again.

I still plan on getting a lifetime subscription for lotro. I'll just try to duck and cover everytime their hypemachine shows up!