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Friday, April 27, 2007
Blizzard getting nervous
I had an e-mail from Blizzard, and several readers who got the same letter also pointed it out to me: Blizzard is offering a free Burning Crusade trial, suspiciously close to the LotRO release date. Apparently they noticed they got competition, even if they are still the 800-pound gorilla. Well, good for us customers, I say.
On the other hand this is a typical example of the development department not talking with the marketing department. The marketing department does the best they can do, offering a free trial. But with the number of people that have WoW without having bought BC being low, the impact of this campaign will be low. What Blizzard *should* have done is to examine the reasons why people leave WoW, and then ask the developers to change the game in a way that keeps people playing. Hint: Adding the Black Temple to the game isn't going to help here. Not sure about the other content additions in patch 2.1, they might be good, they might be the next incarnation of the Silithus grind and the horribly failed tier 0.5 armor upgrade quests.
Interestingly LotRO is about to outflank WoW on the casual side. Two years ago WoW was consider the easy-mode MMORPG. Now people hit the level 70 wall, and only a small percentage of players can break through this wall and into the raid content. So nowadays many players consider the end-game of WoW as "too hard", and are looking for a more casual-friendly alternative. And Lord of the Rings Online is offering just that. LotRO is generally a bit easier than WoW, you need to kill less foozles per quest to get the reward, there is less grind. If you really spend 1 hour killing the same kind of mobs, you are already rewarded with an advanced foozle slayer title and trait. I don't know what will happen when people hit the LotRO end-game, but right now LotRO is the casual alternative to hardcore WoW.
- posted by Tobold @ 8:36 AM Permanent Link
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Naturally leveling up in LotRO and experience it's first 50 levels is going to be a more casual experience than the cutting edge raiding content in WoW. So got no beef there, but that's comparing apples and oranges to some extent.
I haven't levelled up to 50 yet in LotRO, so I can't compare that to leveling 1-60 or 1-70 in WoW. But I have reached level 20 in LotRO and when I compare that to say reaching level 25 in WoW I felt it was actually somewhat harder. Where hard shouldn't be read as requiring impressive player skills necessarily, but more than LotRO in my experience has a lot more quests that require you to group with 1-2 people or more. Whereas in WoW I basically soloed my warlock ways all the way up to 70, without any difficulty to speak of.
From what I've heard from friends LotRO will only have more and more content in higher level ranges that requires grouping. I'd consider that more difficult, as it requires some organization, then the solo game in WoW. I'm not 100% sure how I feel about this, as I don't like forced grouping too much, but I can see where it leads to a more social game. So I'm trying to embrace it!
- Sveral
I haven't levelled up to 50 yet in LotRO, so I can't compare that to leveling 1-60 or 1-70 in WoW. But I have reached level 20 in LotRO and when I compare that to say reaching level 25 in WoW I felt it was actually somewhat harder. Where hard shouldn't be read as requiring impressive player skills necessarily, but more than LotRO in my experience has a lot more quests that require you to group with 1-2 people or more. Whereas in WoW I basically soloed my warlock ways all the way up to 70, without any difficulty to speak of.
From what I've heard from friends LotRO will only have more and more content in higher level ranges that requires grouping. I'd consider that more difficult, as it requires some organization, then the solo game in WoW. I'm not 100% sure how I feel about this, as I don't like forced grouping too much, but I can see where it leads to a more social game. So I'm trying to embrace it!
- Sveral
# posted by 
: 27/4/07 09:02
: 27/4/07 09:02
Yeah, I won't believe that LotRO is truly casual until I see large numbers of people getting to endgame and still calling it casual.
# posted by : 27/4/07 09:07
: 27/4/07 09:07
With WoW:TBC I'm getting some really big Daoc:TOA flasbacks. Daoc was enjoyed by quite a few people back in the days. The first expansion Shrouded Isles was relatively well received. The second one, Trials of Atlantis however is being referred to as a debacle almost wherever I stumble upon a reference to it. The problem with TOA was that it introduced an endgame PvE grind, and people didn't like it. Many, including me left Daoc shortly after. I've often looked back fondly on Daoc as the best designed MMO game so far, pre-TOA. I really hope Mythic is remembering this when designing WAR.
When making an expansion I suspect that the previously existing game has set a bar regarding the difficulty of the end game. You might introduce a bit more, but make it harder than before and people will not like it.
I think that there is much to be learned from MMO history for developers of any MMO game. Study it and you might avoid traps like the one TOA entered. I guess Blizzard probably did to some degree, but they must have missed that one for some reason.
When making an expansion I suspect that the previously existing game has set a bar regarding the difficulty of the end game. You might introduce a bit more, but make it harder than before and people will not like it.
I think that there is much to be learned from MMO history for developers of any MMO game. Study it and you might avoid traps like the one TOA entered. I guess Blizzard probably did to some degree, but they must have missed that one for some reason.
# posted by : 27/4/07 09:56
: 27/4/07 09:56
Blizard learned a lot in the last two years, BC is better than Classic, more quests, shorter distances etc.: more compact. And turbine learned this lessons from Blizzard.
The point is, wow was also great from 1-60(70). The problem is this "endgame" when you visited all "normal" Instances a few times, got your main item upgrades... hard to say how lotr's endgame will look like. We'll see.
BC freeplay: The last numbers I know are 2 months old, 8,5 Million WoW Accounts versus 3,5 Million sold copies of BC. I believe there is still a little gap... so there is no reason not to try.
For sure the main focus of this campaign are people who stopped playing pre-bc, bringing them back to the game.
The point is, wow was also great from 1-60(70). The problem is this "endgame" when you visited all "normal" Instances a few times, got your main item upgrades... hard to say how lotr's endgame will look like. We'll see.
BC freeplay: The last numbers I know are 2 months old, 8,5 Million WoW Accounts versus 3,5 Million sold copies of BC. I believe there is still a little gap... so there is no reason not to try.
For sure the main focus of this campaign are people who stopped playing pre-bc, bringing them back to the game.
# posted by : 27/4/07 10:01
: 27/4/07 10:01
8,5 Million WoW Accounts versus 3,5 Million sold copies of BC
That gap is China-shaped. Due to some hard negotiations with their Chinese distributors on how to share the spoils, BC was delayed for China, and wasn't released in January like everywhere else.
That gap is China-shaped. Due to some hard negotiations with their Chinese distributors on how to share the spoils, BC was delayed for China, and wasn't released in January like everywhere else.
Like I said in a previous post. I think end game burnout is inevitable, and that means developers will have to address player retention in other ways besides hamster wheel instances.
# posted by : 27/4/07 10:58
: 27/4/07 10:58
My first character in WOW took a long time to get to 60. The game was new and exploration was fun.
My last alt is already lv 40 in only a few days.
The point I'm making is that once LotR reaches end-game, people are going to be shooting theough the content in the same way they do in WOW.
Will LotR's end-game be good enough to hold everyone's attention for more than a few months without getting stuck in the same rut as WOW?
My last alt is already lv 40 in only a few days.
The point I'm making is that once LotR reaches end-game, people are going to be shooting theough the content in the same way they do in WOW.
Will LotR's end-game be good enough to hold everyone's attention for more than a few months without getting stuck in the same rut as WOW?
# posted by : 27/4/07 11:37
: 27/4/07 11:37
If, nay *IF*, Turbine delivers what I thought I understood it is preaching, then there shouldn't there be a constant trickle of new zones and land to explore being delivery every few months? The "end game" should therefore be a brief interlude whilst you wait for the next update taking your characters off to Moria, Helms Deep and eventually Gondor and beyond.
If this is actually whats going to happen, then I think this may turn out to be a better model than WoW in that it's open to everyone instead of just those willing to dedicate the time to the grind and perils of raiding.
I do have doubts that it will be as simple as all that though. I suspect these updates will take longer than needed to keep even the most casual topping out with nothing to do (expect Monster Play and the odd Raid).
If this is actually whats going to happen, then I think this may turn out to be a better model than WoW in that it's open to everyone instead of just those willing to dedicate the time to the grind and perils of raiding.
I do have doubts that it will be as simple as all that though. I suspect these updates will take longer than needed to keep even the most casual topping out with nothing to do (expect Monster Play and the odd Raid).
LotRO's idea is not to have an "end-game". They hate that term. They want an "elder-game" that means progression in terms of new zones, new quests, and new stuff for all playstyles (solo-group-raid-crafting). If they can deliver on this premise, they'll be the 1st company in recent memory that has, and will be laudated justly for it.
They also have the belief that all playstyles should have the access to all the same loot/special skills/etc. If they do THIS, they'll be my new heroes.
But time will tell.
The idea that Evendim, which has only be in testing for a couple months, is already pretty much ready for primetime, has me hopeful that the 2nd update will be on the private test server right as Evendim makes its way live.
I have high hopes for LotRO, and I hope they're not ill-founded as they were for WoW.
They also have the belief that all playstyles should have the access to all the same loot/special skills/etc. If they do THIS, they'll be my new heroes.
But time will tell.
The idea that Evendim, which has only be in testing for a couple months, is already pretty much ready for primetime, has me hopeful that the 2nd update will be on the private test server right as Evendim makes its way live.
I have high hopes for LotRO, and I hope they're not ill-founded as they were for WoW.
I'm not so sure that "free offer = nervous". I remember getting free offer coupons in my "vanilla WoW" packaging -- what were they "nervous" about then?
I have to agree with a previous poster about "easy mode" -- my main was a labor of love, but now I can level an alt quickly if I choose to do so. But if you give me a familiar zone / class I can level much faster than an unfamiliar zone / class. And if I ignored professions, and mailed money and gear over from my other characters, it would be much faster than trying to start from scratch on a new server.
I will say that people in my casual circle (including myself) have felt overwhelmed at first by the BC; Hellfire Peninsula really does feel like you're desperately fighting a demon invasion, and it can be frustrating to get two-shotted by a fel reaver you never saw coming, or swarmed by fast-spawning orcs.
RE: Hitting the "70" wall...
And I've said it before, and it is still true 3½ months post-BC release -- in my family / extended family there are six WoW subscriptions all dating from pre-BC, and I still have the only level 70 among us. And yet I play him whenever I can (over leveling an alt), because he's very fun and there are still tons of quests left for me to do -- and I'm finding that there are fun and original quests, too, not just grinds. Along those lines, the 2.1 patch notes indicate that there will be new quests for level 70's, and the Nether Drake, so there will be something to do besides the Black Temple.
Doeg
I have to agree with a previous poster about "easy mode" -- my main was a labor of love, but now I can level an alt quickly if I choose to do so. But if you give me a familiar zone / class I can level much faster than an unfamiliar zone / class. And if I ignored professions, and mailed money and gear over from my other characters, it would be much faster than trying to start from scratch on a new server.
I will say that people in my casual circle (including myself) have felt overwhelmed at first by the BC; Hellfire Peninsula really does feel like you're desperately fighting a demon invasion, and it can be frustrating to get two-shotted by a fel reaver you never saw coming, or swarmed by fast-spawning orcs.
RE: Hitting the "70" wall...
And I've said it before, and it is still true 3½ months post-BC release -- in my family / extended family there are six WoW subscriptions all dating from pre-BC, and I still have the only level 70 among us. And yet I play him whenever I can (over leveling an alt), because he's very fun and there are still tons of quests left for me to do -- and I'm finding that there are fun and original quests, too, not just grinds. Along those lines, the 2.1 patch notes indicate that there will be new quests for level 70's, and the Nether Drake, so there will be something to do besides the Black Temple.
Doeg
# posted by : 27/4/07 16:18
: 27/4/07 16:18
In WoW, I have leveled 3 characters to 60. I was able to join the LotR beta and level to 6 as a dwarf champion. As I played, I realized that I don't want to be a "noob" anymore. I've done all the starting zone and their quests (albiet in a different game), but you was still a low level guy.
I understand that you need to progress and start with everybody else, but is there a "hard" mode setting that would make things challenging? I play video games (RTS and FPS) for the challenge, and Naxxaramas was that to a point, but I'd like to be challenged from the begining. I'd like to play LotR, but I don't want to do the easy leveling first.
I understand that you need to progress and start with everybody else, but is there a "hard" mode setting that would make things challenging? I play video games (RTS and FPS) for the challenge, and Naxxaramas was that to a point, but I'd like to be challenged from the begining. I'd like to play LotR, but I don't want to do the easy leveling first.
# posted by : 27/4/07 17:28
: 27/4/07 17:28
I agree that I don't think this is WoW getting nervous. I think this is something they planned out beforehand, and are releasing now. The reason I think it was preplanned is because there are few players I know of who don't have the expansion... maybe I'm just talking to the wrong players, but the fact that everyone I know has tBC already would imply that this was something they thought of before hand, and is not really needed.
Im still on this easy mode dungeon kick. 5 mans with bosses that drop greens, raids with bosses that drop blues. It would be sooooo awesome.
# posted by : 27/4/07 21:27
: 27/4/07 21:27
kaziel... you idoit.
"the fact that everyone I know has tBC already would imply that this was something they thought of before hand"
Thats like saying "well everyone i met on WoW plays WoW"
If you have TBC chances are you are not meeting ANYONE that just got a copy of orginal wow or havent even stepped a foot in outland. The only "contact" between people that dont have tbc would be in the capital cities during that brief moment in the AH, or maybe in deadwind pass (on your way to karazhan, if you raid) or during that mount ride from gadgetzan --> Caverns of Time. Besides those instances, you will not meet people who dont have a tbc copy. get your logic straight buddy.
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"the fact that everyone I know has tBC already would imply that this was something they thought of before hand"
Thats like saying "well everyone i met on WoW plays WoW"
If you have TBC chances are you are not meeting ANYONE that just got a copy of orginal wow or havent even stepped a foot in outland. The only "contact" between people that dont have tbc would be in the capital cities during that brief moment in the AH, or maybe in deadwind pass (on your way to karazhan, if you raid) or during that mount ride from gadgetzan --> Caverns of Time. Besides those instances, you will not meet people who dont have a tbc copy. get your logic straight buddy.
# posted by : 3/6/07 03:31
: 3/6/07 03:31<< Home
